TNP to gpx conversion?

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TNP to gpx conversion?

Tom Grundy
Does anyone know if GPSBabel (or anything else out there) can read
Terrain Navigator Pro files (.txf, .mxf, .tpa) and convert to gpx or
any other more widely used format?
Thanks

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Re: TNP to gpx conversion?

Robert Lipe-4
Hi, Tom.

I see Terrain Navigator mentioned once in the list, but that was for getting data INTO Terrain Navigator (where the solution was GPX...) and not out of it.

Based on https://tnp.uservoice.com/knowledgebase/articles/172112-marker-mxf-file-import-export-format mxf could probably be done (poorly) with our xcsv import.  We don't expose a way to do colors (we could, we just don't...) and the numeric symbols wouldn't map in the obvious way; your icons in their example would be a textual value of "137" in their example, but that's probably not the most useful part of your data. Lat, long description, and shortname would map naturally.  Just ignoring that last two fields isn't completely unreasonable.

I didn't really see enough about txf or tpa to advise on those.

Their pages are a little weasely, but it looks like they claim to support GPX and KML, but it's not clear if that's reading or writing.  Perhaps a user of this product can pipe in.

Implementing a "real" module that knew about their icon numbers and such would be totally possible if you're motivated to do it.  It looks like a pretty easy project for a budding developer.

RJL

On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 6:45 PM, Tom Grundy <[hidden email]> wrote:
Does anyone know if GPSBabel (or anything else out there) can read
Terrain Navigator Pro files (.txf, .mxf, .tpa) and convert to gpx or
any other more widely used format?
Thanks

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Re: TNP to gpx conversion?

Tom Grundy
Hi Robert, thanks for the reply.  Motivation is the question - there
doesn't seem to be much demand for it and we don't have huge amounts
of data to push, and what data we do have is not in any regular format
- it's a mish-mash of different file types and data sources - so it's
probably quicker to do it by hand.  Very good to know that the markers
may transfer out of the box.

They do write .gpx for tracks or for markers - just not in the same
file; I don't recall if they read .gpx.
They also read .shp in a limited manner for "overlays".
.txf is short for "track transfer file" and .mxf is "marker transfer
file" - they use a few other object types and have corresponding ._xf
files.
.tpa is "Terrain Project Archive" and is a binary file format that can
include all of the various object types.  The .tpa contains the
objects as static data, as opposed to referencing ._xf files.

-Tom

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 11:50 AM, Robert Lipe <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, Tom.
>
> I see Terrain Navigator mentioned once in the list, but that was for getting
> data INTO Terrain Navigator (where the solution was GPX...) and not out of
> it.
>
> Based on
> https://tnp.uservoice.com/knowledgebase/articles/172112-marker-mxf-file-import-export-format
> mxf could probably be done (poorly) with our xcsv import.  We don't expose a
> way to do colors (we could, we just don't...) and the numeric symbols
> wouldn't map in the obvious way; your icons in their example would be a
> textual value of "137" in their example, but that's probably not the most
> useful part of your data. Lat, long description, and shortname would map
> naturally.  Just ignoring that last two fields isn't completely
> unreasonable.
>
> I didn't really see enough about txf or tpa to advise on those.
>
> Their pages are a little weasely, but it looks like they claim to support
> GPX and KML, but it's not clear if that's reading or writing.  Perhaps a
> user of this product can pipe in.
>
> Implementing a "real" module that knew about their icon numbers and such
> would be totally possible if you're motivated to do it.  It looks like a
> pretty easy project for a budding developer.
>
> RJL
>
> On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 6:45 PM, Tom Grundy <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone know if GPSBabel (or anything else out there) can read
>> Terrain Navigator Pro files (.txf, .mxf, .tpa) and convert to gpx or
>> any other more widely used format?
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gpsbabel-misc mailing list http://www.gpsbabel.org
>> [hidden email]
>> To unsubscribe, change list options, or see archives, visit:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gpsbabel-misc
>
>

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Re: TNP to gpx conversion?

Robert Lipe-4


On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 1:57 PM, Tom Grundy <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi Robert, thanks for the reply.  Motivation is the question - there
doesn't seem to be much demand for it and we don't have huge amounts
of data to push, and what data we do have is not in any regular format

While that's how commercial products work (a feature is requested by enough people that won't buy the product until it has it, so they put a developer on it to increase sales...) the difference with open source software is that if anyone wants something badly enough, they can do it themselves or fund someone to do it for them. Ideally, that work goes back to the project so it helps the next person.  So, yeah, if you have ten markers it probably doesn't make sense to hire a college programming student to build a module for it.  If you have ten million such files, it probably does make sense for you.  Ultimately, someone has to want something badly enough to make it happen.

 
- it's a mish-mash of different file types and data sources - so it's
probably quicker to do it by hand.  Very good to know that the markers
may transfer out of the box.

From the department of "not all things worth doing are worth doing well"...

If you just stick a header at the top, our unicsv module seems to read them.
/tmp/blah.mxf:
lat, lon, description, shortname, comment, ignore, icon
43.7601389, -071.2791299, "Cottonwood", "Cttnwd", "A very large tree", 800080, 137
43.7617236, -071.2917695, "Fencepost", "Fncpst", "", 808080, 14
43.7576237, -071.2888850, "Aspen", "Aspen", "", ffff, 137
43.7562457, -071.2777147, "Cache", "Cache", "", ff, 138
43.7576583, -071.2701399, "Tent site", "Tntst", "", ff, 111

$ ./gpsbabel -i unicsv -f /tmp/blah.mxf  -o gpx -F - | head
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<gpx version="1.0" creator="GPSBabel - http://www.gpsbabel.org" xmlns="http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/0">
  <time>2015-11-03T21:10:21.266Z</time>
  <bounds minlat="43.756245700" minlon="-71.291769500" maxlat="43.761723600" maxlon="-71.270139900"/>
  <wpt lat="43.760138900" lon="-71.279129900">
    <name>Cttnwd</name>
    <cmt>Cottonwood</cmt>
    <desc>A very large tree</desc>
    <sym>137</sym>
  </wpt>

Seems legit.  The <sym> isn't really very useful[1] but that's a mere copy/paste exercise once you have it in text.  You want to be sure you replace <sym>137</sym> and not "137" or else you'll be surprised when a 137 appears in the lat/lons.

You can do it without editing the file by defining your own xcsf format.  http://www.gpsbabel.org/htmldoc-development/styles_intro.html

One thing I will take away from this conversation is that our unicsv reader probably should allow you to specify that on the command line.  If you had 10M files like this in 100K files, it would be nice to not edit the files and just say
gpsbabel -i unicsv,columnts="lat, lon, description, shortname, comment, ignore, icon" -f whatever..
in your batch file or script that reads things.  That's probably under half an hour to implement, document, and test and is likely to be useful in the general case.  (If any of our programmers beat me to that, even better.)


Good luck.
RJL

[1] We actually try to do something with a textual number in some cases. For example, if you send it to a device with Garmin Protocol, we'll make 137 into "Contact, Spike" which is a chat head. It's not like we can look at <desc> and go guess it's a Humminbird icon 27 or a Lowrance 10021 or a Bushnell 17 or a JPG picture of a tree or whatever.  In practice, the <sym> in GPX isn't terribly portable across GPX implementations and you kind of have to know the rules of the GPX consumer for them to play nice.  We try to map the common ones; we know "house" in <sym> for many (13) formats where we know the iconography, but from text to GPX we just can't make that jump.  If you know the GPS you're sending it to, you can peek at our implementation (another advantage of open source) to preserve the highest fidelity mapping.  For example, if you were using a Delorme device, replacing >137< with >Deciduous Tree< would keep it separated from an Evergreen or a Birch.  (Since a Birch is deciduous and that's the only tree they specifically call out, I have No Idea why Delorme chose that...)

 

They do write .gpx for tracks or for markers - just not in the same
file; I don't recall if they read .gpx.
They also read .shp in a limited manner for "overlays".
.txf is short for "track transfer file" and .mxf is "marker transfer
file" - they use a few other object types and have corresponding ._xf
files.
.tpa is "Terrain Project Archive" and is a binary file format that can
include all of the various object types.  The .tpa contains the
objects as static data, as opposed to referencing ._xf files.

-Tom

On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 11:50 AM, Robert Lipe <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hi, Tom.
>
> I see Terrain Navigator mentioned once in the list, but that was for getting
> data INTO Terrain Navigator (where the solution was GPX...) and not out of
> it.
>
> Based on
> https://tnp.uservoice.com/knowledgebase/articles/172112-marker-mxf-file-import-export-format
> mxf could probably be done (poorly) with our xcsv import.  We don't expose a
> way to do colors (we could, we just don't...) and the numeric symbols
> wouldn't map in the obvious way; your icons in their example would be a
> textual value of "137" in their example, but that's probably not the most
> useful part of your data. Lat, long description, and shortname would map
> naturally.  Just ignoring that last two fields isn't completely
> unreasonable.
>
> I didn't really see enough about txf or tpa to advise on those.
>
> Their pages are a little weasely, but it looks like they claim to support
> GPX and KML, but it's not clear if that's reading or writing.  Perhaps a
> user of this product can pipe in.
>
> Implementing a "real" module that knew about their icon numbers and such
> would be totally possible if you're motivated to do it.  It looks like a
> pretty easy project for a budding developer.
>
> RJL
>
> On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 6:45 PM, Tom Grundy <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Does anyone know if GPSBabel (or anything else out there) can read
>> Terrain Navigator Pro files (.txf, .mxf, .tpa) and convert to gpx or
>> any other more widely used format?
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gpsbabel-misc mailing list http://www.gpsbabel.org
>> [hidden email]
>> To unsubscribe, change list options, or see archives, visit:
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/gpsbabel-misc
>
>


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Re: TNP to gpx conversion?

Robert Lipe-4
One thing I will take away from this conversation is that our unicsv reader probably should allow you to specify that on the command line.  If you had 10M files like this in 100K files, it would be nice to not edit the files and just say
gpsbabel -i unicsv,columnts="lat, lon, description, shortname, comment, ignore, icon" -f whatever..
in your batch file or script that reads things.  That's probably under half an hour to implement, document, and test and is likely to be useful in the general case. 

Our command line parser makes that syntax not quite work, but I've landed that into the tree as

https://github.com/gpsbabel/gpsbabel/commit/d395ae2bd3db4c92df1f9d9d89907e889672fa0c

I'm not totally in love with the details. so feel free to riff on it before we next release.

RJL 

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